Post by Rob Caprio on May 2, 2022 20:35:07 GMT -5
All portions ©️ Robert Caprio 2006-2024
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An interesting figure in the anti-Casto Cuban groups that claimed to have met Lee Harvey Oswald (LHO) is Antonio Veciana. During their tenure in the late 1970s the House Select Committee on Assassinations (HSCA) would look into him and his claim about meeting LHO shortly before the assassination of President John F. Kennedy (JFK).
The HSCA Says...Antonio Veciana.
******************************************
Antonio Veciana told a staff investigator from the office of Senator Richard Schweiker (R-PA) on March 2, 1976, that from mid-1960 until mid-1973 that he had been "directed and advised" in his anti-Castro activities by an American known to him as Maurice Bishop.
Bishop helped in guiding him on assassination plans regarding Cuban Premier Fidel Castro. According to Veciana, Bishop also directed him to form Alpha 66 in 1962, and paid him $253,000 for his services when they parted ways in 1973.
Veciana said that he met LHO in August or September 1963 as well. Here is what the HSCA wrote about this meeting.
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www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/pages/HSCA_Vol10_0021a.gif
115. Veciana revealed further that at one meeting with Bishop in Dallas in late-August or September 1963, he saw with him a young man he later recognized as Lee Harvey Oswald.
116. Veciana told Senator Schweiker's investigator that he had not previously disclosed that information to anyone. (HSCA X, p. 37)
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/html/HSCA_Vol10_0021a.htm
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This of course caught the attention of the future HSCA. Veciana was investigated and brought to testify before the HSCA under oath about this matter. I will not get into all the projects that he had with Bishop as many of them probably have nothing to do with the assassination of JFK.
He said that he did not know which agency that Bishop worked for as he would not tell him, but it isn't hard to figure out as only one was involved in anti-Castro activities and the assassination of Castro -- the CIA. It is important to know that many researchers have said that Bishop was really David Atlee Phillips of the CIA.
Here are the relevant points about this alleged meeting between Veciana and Bishop that included a man that looked like LHO.
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138. The committee's interest in the relationship between Antonio Veciana and Maurice Bishop is of course predicated on Veciana's contention that he saw Bishop with Lee Harvey Oswald in Dallas a few months before the assassination of John F. Kennedy.
139. Veciana could not specifically pinpoint the date of that meeting with Bishop. He believed it was in late August 1963. Over the years that he knew Bishop, Veciana had at least five meetings with him in Dallas. The meeting at which Oswald was present took place in the lobby of a large office building in the downtown section of the city, perhaps a bank or an insurance building with a blue facade or lobby. When Veciana arrived for the meeting, Bishop was there talking with Oswald. Veciana does not recall whether he was introduced to Oswald by name, but said he did not have any conversation with him. Oswald remained with Bishop and Veciana only for a brief time as they walked toward a nearby coffee shop. Oswald then departed and Bishop and Veciana continued their meeting alone.
140. Veciana testified that he recognized the young man with Bishop as Lee Harvey Oswald after seeing photographs of him following the Kennedy assassination. There was absolutely no doubt in his mind that the man was Oswald, not just someone who resembled him. Veciana pointed out that he had been trained to remember the physical characteristics of people and that if it was not Oswald it was his "exact" double.
141. Veciana's next meeting with Bishop was in Miami about 2 months after the assassination of President Kennedy. Although they discussed the assassination in general, Veciana did not specifically ask him about Oswald. "I was not going to make the mistake of getting myself involved in something that did not concern me," he testified. Also, he said, "That was a very difficult situation because I was afraid. We both understood. I could guess that he knew that I was knowledgeable ot that and I learned that the best way is not to know, not to get to know things that don't concern you, so I respected the rules and I didn't mention that ever."
142. Bishop himself, however, did suggest to Veciana the possibility of some involvement. At the time there were newspaper reports that Oswald had met with some Cubans during his visit to Mexico. Veciana said that Bishop was aware that he had a relative, Guillermo Ruiz, who was a high-ranking officer in Castro's intelligence service stationed in Mexico City. Bishop told Veciana that if he could get in touch with Ruiz, he would pay Ruiz a large amount of money to say publicly that it was him and his wife who had met with Oswald. Veciana agreed to make the attempt to contact Ruiz because, as he testifies. "I knew that Ruiz would be tempted with money; he liked money." Veciana, however, was never successful in contacting Ruiz, and when he mentioned it to Bishop a couple of months later, Bishop told him to forget it. That was the last time Veciana ever spoke about the Kennedy assassination or Lee Harvey Oswald to Bishop, and, he testified, he never told anyone about seeing Oswald until questioned by Senator Schweiker's investigate. (Ibid., pp. 40-41)
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/html/HSCA_Vol10_0022b.htm
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There seems to be no doubt that this was LHO or an "exact double" as Veciana says. Why would LHO be with Bishop? We know that Phillips was in charge of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee (FPCC) for the CIA and LHO would set up a one-man branch in New Orleans during his time there in the summer of 1963. Since LHO was seen with Bishop (presumed to be Phillips) this makes sense as LHO was deep into anti and pro-Castro things during his time in New Orleans. It is not a huge leap to say that LHO most likely setup that FPCC branch in New Orleans on the "direction" of Phillips (a.k.a. Bishop). LHO could have known him under a different name too. Like "A. Hidlell" for example as LHO said he was being directed by a man with this name while in New Orleans.
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At the close of the interview [with Martello], Oswald requested to speak to a representative of the FBI. Martello called over, telling the FBI that Oswald “was desirous of seeing an agent and supplying to him information with regard to his activities with the FPCC in New Orleans.” [FBI item #100-16601-18; declassified 1977] FBI Special Agent John Quigley then spent an hour and a half talking with Oswald on a sweltering Saturday morning at the police station.
Oswald told the FBI man that “A.J. Hidell” had ASKED HIM to distribute FPCC literature two days before the street incident.* Quigley later maintained that he had never heard of Oswald before. Yet in 1961, after Oswald’s “defection” to the USSR, his Navy file had been reviewed by the FBI in New Orleans, where he was born. JOHN QUIGLEY HAD HANDLED THE CASE. (Dick Russell, The Man Who Knew Too Much, p. 252) (Emphasis mine)
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Was the Hidell person the same as the Bishop person? Both David Atlee Phillips of the CIA? Could be. This would confirm that LHO was being "sheep-dipped" in New Orleans as Jim Garrison said so many years ago. Veciana was also related to a man that is tied to LHO as well.
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161. Another aspect of Veciana's allegations that were of interest to the committee was Bishop's suggestion of developing a misinformation scheme involving a Castro intelligence agent and Oswald. Veciana said that Bishop knew that a relative of his was in the Cuban Intelligence service assigned to mexico City at the time of the Kennedy assassination. According to Veciana, a news story was circulating immediately after the assassination that Oswald had met a couple on the Mexican border while on his way to Mexico City prior to the assassination. Bishop, Veciana said, suggested he attempt to get intouch with his relative and offer him a bribe to say that it was he and his wife who met Oswald in Mexico. Veciana said he was never able to get in touch with his relative about it and eventually Bishop told him to forget it.
162. Veciana's relative, Orestes Guillermo Ruiz Perez, was, in fact, a relative by marriage, the husband of a first cousin to Veciana. Veciana said he first learned of Ruiz's affiliation with Castro's intelligence service shorly after Castro took power. He and Ruiz were walking in a Havana park when they were stopped and searched by Castro's police. Ruiz was found to be carrying a gun and was taken away. Concerned, Veciana immediately placed a call to a close friend inside Castro's government, Minister of Finance Rufo Lopez-Fresquet. Lopez-Fresquet told Veciana not to worry about Ruiz because Ruiz was actually working for the intelligence service.
164. The committee was able to interview Orestes Guillermo Ruiz in Havana. Ruiz acknowledged that he was related to Veciana through marriage. He said that "everyone in Cuba" knows that Veciana is associated with the CIA and was involved in assassination attempts on Castro. He said, however, aside from what he read in the American newspapers, he has no knowledge of Veciana's association with Maurice Bishop or who Maurice Bishop could be. He said he was never contacted by Veciana about Oswald and, in fact, has not seen Veciana since 1959. (Ibid., pp.44-45)
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/html/HSCA_Vol10_0024b.htm
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Ruiz would call Veciana a coward and a man that "could not be believed." Ruiz was part of Castro's G-2 intelligence apparatus, so can he be believed? Here is what Gaeton Fonzi wrote about him in his book "The Last Investigation".
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At the time, there were newspaper stories about Oswald having met with a Cuban couple in Mexico City. Veciana recalls these stories reported that the wife spoke excellent English. Bishop (allegedly David Atlee Phillips posing as "Maurice Bishop") said that he knew that Veciana had a cousin, Guillermo Ruiz, in Castro's intelligence’s service (G-2) who then happened to be stationed in Mexico City. Ruiz's wife, coincidentally, spoke excellent English. Bishop asked Veciana to try to get in touch with Ruiz and offer him A LARGE AMOUNT of money IF Ruiz would say that it was he and his wife who had met with Oswald." (TLI, p. 143)
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This shows how easy it can be to get people to say things that are not true. Money talks. Of course Ruiz would publicly say those things about Veciana as he was tied in with trying to kill Castro and Ruiz was in his intelligence service! I think it is Ruiz who cannot be believed as he would not gain anything by telling the truth.
Senator Schweiker was the first to notice a strong resemblance between "Bishop" and Phillips when he saw the sketch that had been made off of Veciana's recollections. Veciana would say that Phillips was not Bishop after meeting him in 1976, but what else could he say? Here is how the HSCA (Gaeton Fonzi) concluded this issue.
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204. No definitive conclusion could be reached about the credibility of Antonio Veciana's allegations regarding his relationship with a Maurice Bishop. Additionally, no definitive conclusions could be drawn as to the identity or affiliations of Bishop, if such an individual existed. While no evidence was found to discredit Veciana's testimony, there was some evidence to support it, although none of it was conclusive. The available documentary record was sufficient to indicate that the U.S. Government's intelligence community had a keen interest in Antonio Veciana during the early 1960's and that he was willing to receive the financial support he needed for the military operations of his anti-Castro groups from those sources. From the files of these agencies, it thus appears reasonable that an association similar to the alleged Maurice Bishop story actually existed. But whether Veciana's contact was really named Maurice Bishop, or if he was, whether he did all of the things Veciana claims, and if so, with which U.S. intelligence agency he was associated, could not be determined. No corroboration was found for Veciana's alleged meeting with Lee Harvey Oswald. (Ibid., pp. 51-52)
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/html/HSCA_Vol10_0028a.htm
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So nothing definitive was reached by the HSCA on this issue. There was evidence to support Veciana's testimony however, and none to discredit it. What do you think? Do you think that Bishop was Phillips? Do you think both had a meeting that included LHO in 1963?
cdn.muckrock.com/news_images/2018/04/04/HSCA.jpg.1200x400_q85.jpg
alchetron.com/cdn/antonio-veciana-1d8f51fd-766d-478e-8cb2-4732bdce164-resize-750.jpeg
An interesting figure in the anti-Casto Cuban groups that claimed to have met Lee Harvey Oswald (LHO) is Antonio Veciana. During their tenure in the late 1970s the House Select Committee on Assassinations (HSCA) would look into him and his claim about meeting LHO shortly before the assassination of President John F. Kennedy (JFK).
The HSCA Says...Antonio Veciana.
******************************************
Antonio Veciana told a staff investigator from the office of Senator Richard Schweiker (R-PA) on March 2, 1976, that from mid-1960 until mid-1973 that he had been "directed and advised" in his anti-Castro activities by an American known to him as Maurice Bishop.
Bishop helped in guiding him on assassination plans regarding Cuban Premier Fidel Castro. According to Veciana, Bishop also directed him to form Alpha 66 in 1962, and paid him $253,000 for his services when they parted ways in 1973.
Veciana said that he met LHO in August or September 1963 as well. Here is what the HSCA wrote about this meeting.
Quote on
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/pages/HSCA_Vol10_0021a.gif
115. Veciana revealed further that at one meeting with Bishop in Dallas in late-August or September 1963, he saw with him a young man he later recognized as Lee Harvey Oswald.
116. Veciana told Senator Schweiker's investigator that he had not previously disclosed that information to anyone. (HSCA X, p. 37)
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/html/HSCA_Vol10_0021a.htm
Quote off
This of course caught the attention of the future HSCA. Veciana was investigated and brought to testify before the HSCA under oath about this matter. I will not get into all the projects that he had with Bishop as many of them probably have nothing to do with the assassination of JFK.
He said that he did not know which agency that Bishop worked for as he would not tell him, but it isn't hard to figure out as only one was involved in anti-Castro activities and the assassination of Castro -- the CIA. It is important to know that many researchers have said that Bishop was really David Atlee Phillips of the CIA.
Here are the relevant points about this alleged meeting between Veciana and Bishop that included a man that looked like LHO.
Quote on
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/pages/HSCA_Vol10_0022b.gif
138. The committee's interest in the relationship between Antonio Veciana and Maurice Bishop is of course predicated on Veciana's contention that he saw Bishop with Lee Harvey Oswald in Dallas a few months before the assassination of John F. Kennedy.
139. Veciana could not specifically pinpoint the date of that meeting with Bishop. He believed it was in late August 1963. Over the years that he knew Bishop, Veciana had at least five meetings with him in Dallas. The meeting at which Oswald was present took place in the lobby of a large office building in the downtown section of the city, perhaps a bank or an insurance building with a blue facade or lobby. When Veciana arrived for the meeting, Bishop was there talking with Oswald. Veciana does not recall whether he was introduced to Oswald by name, but said he did not have any conversation with him. Oswald remained with Bishop and Veciana only for a brief time as they walked toward a nearby coffee shop. Oswald then departed and Bishop and Veciana continued their meeting alone.
140. Veciana testified that he recognized the young man with Bishop as Lee Harvey Oswald after seeing photographs of him following the Kennedy assassination. There was absolutely no doubt in his mind that the man was Oswald, not just someone who resembled him. Veciana pointed out that he had been trained to remember the physical characteristics of people and that if it was not Oswald it was his "exact" double.
141. Veciana's next meeting with Bishop was in Miami about 2 months after the assassination of President Kennedy. Although they discussed the assassination in general, Veciana did not specifically ask him about Oswald. "I was not going to make the mistake of getting myself involved in something that did not concern me," he testified. Also, he said, "That was a very difficult situation because I was afraid. We both understood. I could guess that he knew that I was knowledgeable ot that and I learned that the best way is not to know, not to get to know things that don't concern you, so I respected the rules and I didn't mention that ever."
142. Bishop himself, however, did suggest to Veciana the possibility of some involvement. At the time there were newspaper reports that Oswald had met with some Cubans during his visit to Mexico. Veciana said that Bishop was aware that he had a relative, Guillermo Ruiz, who was a high-ranking officer in Castro's intelligence service stationed in Mexico City. Bishop told Veciana that if he could get in touch with Ruiz, he would pay Ruiz a large amount of money to say publicly that it was him and his wife who had met with Oswald. Veciana agreed to make the attempt to contact Ruiz because, as he testifies. "I knew that Ruiz would be tempted with money; he liked money." Veciana, however, was never successful in contacting Ruiz, and when he mentioned it to Bishop a couple of months later, Bishop told him to forget it. That was the last time Veciana ever spoke about the Kennedy assassination or Lee Harvey Oswald to Bishop, and, he testified, he never told anyone about seeing Oswald until questioned by Senator Schweiker's investigate. (Ibid., pp. 40-41)
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/html/HSCA_Vol10_0022b.htm
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There seems to be no doubt that this was LHO or an "exact double" as Veciana says. Why would LHO be with Bishop? We know that Phillips was in charge of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee (FPCC) for the CIA and LHO would set up a one-man branch in New Orleans during his time there in the summer of 1963. Since LHO was seen with Bishop (presumed to be Phillips) this makes sense as LHO was deep into anti and pro-Castro things during his time in New Orleans. It is not a huge leap to say that LHO most likely setup that FPCC branch in New Orleans on the "direction" of Phillips (a.k.a. Bishop). LHO could have known him under a different name too. Like "A. Hidlell" for example as LHO said he was being directed by a man with this name while in New Orleans.
Quote on
At the close of the interview [with Martello], Oswald requested to speak to a representative of the FBI. Martello called over, telling the FBI that Oswald “was desirous of seeing an agent and supplying to him information with regard to his activities with the FPCC in New Orleans.” [FBI item #100-16601-18; declassified 1977] FBI Special Agent John Quigley then spent an hour and a half talking with Oswald on a sweltering Saturday morning at the police station.
Oswald told the FBI man that “A.J. Hidell” had ASKED HIM to distribute FPCC literature two days before the street incident.* Quigley later maintained that he had never heard of Oswald before. Yet in 1961, after Oswald’s “defection” to the USSR, his Navy file had been reviewed by the FBI in New Orleans, where he was born. JOHN QUIGLEY HAD HANDLED THE CASE. (Dick Russell, The Man Who Knew Too Much, p. 252) (Emphasis mine)
Quote off
Was the Hidell person the same as the Bishop person? Both David Atlee Phillips of the CIA? Could be. This would confirm that LHO was being "sheep-dipped" in New Orleans as Jim Garrison said so many years ago. Veciana was also related to a man that is tied to LHO as well.
Quote on
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/pages/HSCA_Vol10_0024b.gif
161. Another aspect of Veciana's allegations that were of interest to the committee was Bishop's suggestion of developing a misinformation scheme involving a Castro intelligence agent and Oswald. Veciana said that Bishop knew that a relative of his was in the Cuban Intelligence service assigned to mexico City at the time of the Kennedy assassination. According to Veciana, a news story was circulating immediately after the assassination that Oswald had met a couple on the Mexican border while on his way to Mexico City prior to the assassination. Bishop, Veciana said, suggested he attempt to get intouch with his relative and offer him a bribe to say that it was he and his wife who met Oswald in Mexico. Veciana said he was never able to get in touch with his relative about it and eventually Bishop told him to forget it.
162. Veciana's relative, Orestes Guillermo Ruiz Perez, was, in fact, a relative by marriage, the husband of a first cousin to Veciana. Veciana said he first learned of Ruiz's affiliation with Castro's intelligence service shorly after Castro took power. He and Ruiz were walking in a Havana park when they were stopped and searched by Castro's police. Ruiz was found to be carrying a gun and was taken away. Concerned, Veciana immediately placed a call to a close friend inside Castro's government, Minister of Finance Rufo Lopez-Fresquet. Lopez-Fresquet told Veciana not to worry about Ruiz because Ruiz was actually working for the intelligence service.
164. The committee was able to interview Orestes Guillermo Ruiz in Havana. Ruiz acknowledged that he was related to Veciana through marriage. He said that "everyone in Cuba" knows that Veciana is associated with the CIA and was involved in assassination attempts on Castro. He said, however, aside from what he read in the American newspapers, he has no knowledge of Veciana's association with Maurice Bishop or who Maurice Bishop could be. He said he was never contacted by Veciana about Oswald and, in fact, has not seen Veciana since 1959. (Ibid., pp.44-45)
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/html/HSCA_Vol10_0024b.htm
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Ruiz would call Veciana a coward and a man that "could not be believed." Ruiz was part of Castro's G-2 intelligence apparatus, so can he be believed? Here is what Gaeton Fonzi wrote about him in his book "The Last Investigation".
Quote on
At the time, there were newspaper stories about Oswald having met with a Cuban couple in Mexico City. Veciana recalls these stories reported that the wife spoke excellent English. Bishop (allegedly David Atlee Phillips posing as "Maurice Bishop") said that he knew that Veciana had a cousin, Guillermo Ruiz, in Castro's intelligence’s service (G-2) who then happened to be stationed in Mexico City. Ruiz's wife, coincidentally, spoke excellent English. Bishop asked Veciana to try to get in touch with Ruiz and offer him A LARGE AMOUNT of money IF Ruiz would say that it was he and his wife who had met with Oswald." (TLI, p. 143)
Quote off
This shows how easy it can be to get people to say things that are not true. Money talks. Of course Ruiz would publicly say those things about Veciana as he was tied in with trying to kill Castro and Ruiz was in his intelligence service! I think it is Ruiz who cannot be believed as he would not gain anything by telling the truth.
Senator Schweiker was the first to notice a strong resemblance between "Bishop" and Phillips when he saw the sketch that had been made off of Veciana's recollections. Veciana would say that Phillips was not Bishop after meeting him in 1976, but what else could he say? Here is how the HSCA (Gaeton Fonzi) concluded this issue.
Quote on
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/pages/HSCA_Vol10_0028a.gif
204. No definitive conclusion could be reached about the credibility of Antonio Veciana's allegations regarding his relationship with a Maurice Bishop. Additionally, no definitive conclusions could be drawn as to the identity or affiliations of Bishop, if such an individual existed. While no evidence was found to discredit Veciana's testimony, there was some evidence to support it, although none of it was conclusive. The available documentary record was sufficient to indicate that the U.S. Government's intelligence community had a keen interest in Antonio Veciana during the early 1960's and that he was willing to receive the financial support he needed for the military operations of his anti-Castro groups from those sources. From the files of these agencies, it thus appears reasonable that an association similar to the alleged Maurice Bishop story actually existed. But whether Veciana's contact was really named Maurice Bishop, or if he was, whether he did all of the things Veciana claims, and if so, with which U.S. intelligence agency he was associated, could not be determined. No corroboration was found for Veciana's alleged meeting with Lee Harvey Oswald. (Ibid., pp. 51-52)
www.historymatters.com/archive/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol10/html/HSCA_Vol10_0028a.htm
Quote off
So nothing definitive was reached by the HSCA on this issue. There was evidence to support Veciana's testimony however, and none to discredit it. What do you think? Do you think that Bishop was Phillips? Do you think both had a meeting that included LHO in 1963?