Post by Rob Caprio on Oct 11, 2023 20:13:10 GMT -5
All portions are ©️ Robert Caprio 2006-2024
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The Warren Commission (WC) claimed in September 1964 that Lee Harvey Oswald (LHO) alone killed President John F. Kennedy (JFK). They were adamant that he had no assistance from anyone or any group in perpetrating this crime.
They were just as adamant that he had NO relationship with anyone in this case and most particularly with his own killer Jack Ruby. None. Don't even think about it. If you were to ask them about this, you would most likely get the "What you are talking about Willis?" response (from the show "Different Strokes" by Gary Coleman).
We have examined this possibility before in other posts and there is good evidence showing that there was some kind of knowledge of each other. The term "relationship" was chosen as that illustrates a deeper connection between two people and clearly the WC felt no one could show this, but that is not relevant here. Co-conspirators don't have to have a "relationship" to work together.
Did LHO and Jack Ruby know each other?
Well, a Mrs. Carnes Nance thought so as she spoke with a confidential informant (Dallas T-3) about this who then passed it on to FBI Special Agent Charles T. Brown. Here is the relevant portion of her comments about this.
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...Mrs. [CARNES] NANCE had a friend who recently visited at the home of a person residing next door to the Beckley Street address where LEE HARVEY OSWALD resided just prior to the assassination of President KENNEDY. Informant stated the lady who lives in the house next door to where OSWALD lived reportedly made a complaint that she had trouble with JACK RUBY several times about parking his car in her driveway when he would visit OSWALD. (FBI 105-82555, Oswald HQ File, Section 143)
www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=58974#relPageId=106
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I can hear the WC defenders saying, "This is third-hand information and cannot be taken seriously." Well, IF this was true, why did the FBI waste time making a report about this information then? Especially when we consider their inherent desire to ELIMINATE anything that did NOT agree with the official version of events. The informant said that someone asked the woman who lived next door to 1026 N. Beckley Avenue roominghouse why she did not report this and she said that she did not want to get involved. Considering the fate of a number of people who saw things they shouldn't have, how can we blame her?
The report states that a previous "investigation" that took place on Beckley Avenue (the report keeps saying Street) failed to uncover this type of information. This is shocking to hear, NOT. If they bothered to ask this woman perhaps she was afraid to speak with the FBI or the Dallas Police Department (DPD). Here is more "cover your butt" stuff from the report.
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Previous investigation in the neighborhood of 1026 N. Beckley Street, Dallas, the residence of LEE HARVEY OSWALD at the time of the assassination, failed to develop any information indicating an association between OSWALD and RUBY. The individuals in the neighborhood were specifically questioned concerning OSWALD's activities and associates and photographs of RUBY were likewise exhibited and none of such individuals such contacted was able to identify RUBY as having been in that neighborhood or having associated in any way with OSWALD. (Ibid.)
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Does anyone really believe that this was done? When Dallas Police Officer J.D. Tippit (JDT) was shot on November 22, 1963, the authorities didn't even bother to canvass the neighborhood to see what the residents saw, but we are to believe that they went around with a photograph of Jack Ruby asking the residents if they had ever seen him with LHO. Sure. Nice fantasy. Why would the FBI do this when this would be the last thing the WC or their boss, FBI Director J. Edgar Hoover (JEH), wanted to show? And, IF they had done this as claimed, why was there a need to recanvass in March 1964 then?
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On March 16, 1964, the following neighbors residing on each side of 1026 N. Beckley Street were reinterviewed and specifically questioned regarding the presence of a 1961 white Oldsmobile having been parked in their respective driveways at anytime immediately preceding November 22, 1963. It should be noted that previous investigation has developed that JACK L. RUBY owned a 1961 white Oldsmobile. All of the below-named individuals denied recalling a 1961 Oldsmobile having been parked in their driveways at any time and specifically denied having any knowledge of visits by anyone resembling JACK L. RUBY to the rooming house at 1026 N. Beckley Street:
WILLIAM AND LAVANDA WILSON, 1022 N. Beckley Street;
Mr. and Mrs. G.W. MILLER, 1028 N. Beckley Street;
ELLA McNABB, 1030 N. Beckley Street;
LEONARD GRISWOLD, 1014 N. Beckley Street. (Ibid., pp. 106-107)
www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=58974#relPageId=107
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Did we really expect anything different from the FBI? Notice the sleight of hand that they used too. They were pros with this kind of wording in reports. The original statement used the phrasing of "just prior" to the assassination in terms of when this Oldsmobile parked in their driveway, but the FBI changed it to "anytime IMMEDIATELY preceding November 22, 1963." It isn't huge, but it is different. Just prior could means days ahead of time whereas immediately would suggest the day or evening before the day in question.
The FBI also assumed that Ruby would use his own car (the 1961 white Oldsmobile) and inquired about that particular automobile, but why couldn't he have used another car? Furthermore, why couldn't someone have driven him there? Why was the FBI assuming all the time when it involved things they didn't want to really find out about? Keep in mind, the original report made NO mention of what type of car was parking in the woman's driveway. This may seem small to you, but the FBI did this kind of thing continuously and it adds up to a lot at some point. Investigations should be run with a blank slate and based on initial statements only.
Needless to say, we would progress to the next step of it all being a "mistake." We also see this continually in FBI reports when someone said something they didn't want to hear. On March 20, 1964, T-3 told the FBI that it was probably all gossip and that the FBI should "under no circumstances" interview Mrs. Nance as it could "cost him his job." How could interviewing Mrs. Nance cost T-3 his job? Did he work for her or her family? Moreover, imagine most of us TELLING the FBI what to do and having them listen to us. Not going to happen very much if at all. Why wasn't T-3 admonished for passing on "gossip" and wasting the FBI's time? They did this to other witnesses that reported things that they did NOT want to deal with.
Another informant (T-4) passed on similar information on March 2, 1964, as she said that she attended a meeting of the Oak Cliff Society of Fine Arts on February 7, 1964, and heard Mrs. Dick Loomis state, "I saw Ruby come out of Oswald's apartment." (Ibid., p. 108) Mr. Loomis was the President of the Oak Cliff Society of Fine Arts and T-4 was a member. Of course, the FBI would speak with her, but not give us her first name as they kept referring to her as Mrs. William Loomis.
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...She attended a meeting of that group on February 7, 1964, at which time she made a remark that she saw a man she believed to be JACK L. RUBY, the convicted murderer or LEE HARVEY OSWALD, get out of a car with another man in the vicinity of her home in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas. She stated they apparently went away to some nearby apartment which she presumed must have been the apartment of LEE HARVEY OSWALD.
...Mrs. LOOMIS advised she has never known either LEE HARVEY OSWALD or JACK L. RUBY and was not positive of any connection between them. However, she stated one of the persons she saw getting out of a car in front of her home seemed to bear a marked resemblance to JACK L. RUBY. She stated she learned from the press, television, radio, and news media that both RUBY and OSWALD had resided in Oak Cliff at one time and she had just drawn her own conclusions about the alleged association.
Mrs. LOOMIS denied making the statement at the February 7, 1964, club meeting that "I saw Ruby come out of Oswald's apartment." (Ibid., p. 109)
www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=58974#relPageId=109
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Notice that Mrs. Loomis said what I just posited above -- that the man who resembled Jack Ruby got out of a car that had another person in it. Why did the FBI assume Ruby would drive himself in his own car when the original report never mentioned that possibility? Because it allowed them to "investigate" a possibility that they could control and get the right result from -- a negative one. It is easy to reach your conclusion when you put in faulty information.
Keep in mind too that by February 1964 images of Jack Ruby would have been on television and in newspapers a bunch so she would certainly know what he looked like to compare to the man that she observed. There was no motivation to lie about this stuff either as it would bring the wrath of the FBI down upon you.
Again, notice that they had her saying she wasn't aware of "any connection between them'' when this is NOT the relevant portion of her sighting. IF she saw Ruby near LHO's rooming house that is RELEVANT in showing that perhaps they were working on something together. It is how you define the words "connection" and "relationship" as we do NOT need to show this. The burden was on the WC to prove their claims. All we need to do is show that Ruby and LHO had contact prior to the assassination. This sighting and the one mentioned above are good evidence for showing that this was possible. That is all you need as the defense team as you just want to expand the reasonable doubt of your client's guilt. IF this was presented in court it would do that as there is NO other reason for Jack Ruby to be near LHO's rooming house. NONE.
When we add this with all the other information/evidence presented already in other posts showing some kind of connection between the two men it becomes very strong in creating a ton of reasonable doubt.
www.thefamouspeople.com/profiles/images/lee-harvey-oswald-8.jpg
www.thefamouspeople.com/profiles/images/jack-ruby-5.jpg
d1mxaomdth3elf.cloudfront.net/com/tours/jfk-assassination-bus-tour/oswald-rooming-house.jpg
The Warren Commission (WC) claimed in September 1964 that Lee Harvey Oswald (LHO) alone killed President John F. Kennedy (JFK). They were adamant that he had no assistance from anyone or any group in perpetrating this crime.
They were just as adamant that he had NO relationship with anyone in this case and most particularly with his own killer Jack Ruby. None. Don't even think about it. If you were to ask them about this, you would most likely get the "What you are talking about Willis?" response (from the show "Different Strokes" by Gary Coleman).
We have examined this possibility before in other posts and there is good evidence showing that there was some kind of knowledge of each other. The term "relationship" was chosen as that illustrates a deeper connection between two people and clearly the WC felt no one could show this, but that is not relevant here. Co-conspirators don't have to have a "relationship" to work together.
Did LHO and Jack Ruby know each other?
Well, a Mrs. Carnes Nance thought so as she spoke with a confidential informant (Dallas T-3) about this who then passed it on to FBI Special Agent Charles T. Brown. Here is the relevant portion of her comments about this.
Quote on
...Mrs. [CARNES] NANCE had a friend who recently visited at the home of a person residing next door to the Beckley Street address where LEE HARVEY OSWALD resided just prior to the assassination of President KENNEDY. Informant stated the lady who lives in the house next door to where OSWALD lived reportedly made a complaint that she had trouble with JACK RUBY several times about parking his car in her driveway when he would visit OSWALD. (FBI 105-82555, Oswald HQ File, Section 143)
www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=58974#relPageId=106
Quote off
I can hear the WC defenders saying, "This is third-hand information and cannot be taken seriously." Well, IF this was true, why did the FBI waste time making a report about this information then? Especially when we consider their inherent desire to ELIMINATE anything that did NOT agree with the official version of events. The informant said that someone asked the woman who lived next door to 1026 N. Beckley Avenue roominghouse why she did not report this and she said that she did not want to get involved. Considering the fate of a number of people who saw things they shouldn't have, how can we blame her?
The report states that a previous "investigation" that took place on Beckley Avenue (the report keeps saying Street) failed to uncover this type of information. This is shocking to hear, NOT. If they bothered to ask this woman perhaps she was afraid to speak with the FBI or the Dallas Police Department (DPD). Here is more "cover your butt" stuff from the report.
Quote on
Previous investigation in the neighborhood of 1026 N. Beckley Street, Dallas, the residence of LEE HARVEY OSWALD at the time of the assassination, failed to develop any information indicating an association between OSWALD and RUBY. The individuals in the neighborhood were specifically questioned concerning OSWALD's activities and associates and photographs of RUBY were likewise exhibited and none of such individuals such contacted was able to identify RUBY as having been in that neighborhood or having associated in any way with OSWALD. (Ibid.)
Quote off
Does anyone really believe that this was done? When Dallas Police Officer J.D. Tippit (JDT) was shot on November 22, 1963, the authorities didn't even bother to canvass the neighborhood to see what the residents saw, but we are to believe that they went around with a photograph of Jack Ruby asking the residents if they had ever seen him with LHO. Sure. Nice fantasy. Why would the FBI do this when this would be the last thing the WC or their boss, FBI Director J. Edgar Hoover (JEH), wanted to show? And, IF they had done this as claimed, why was there a need to recanvass in March 1964 then?
Quote on
On March 16, 1964, the following neighbors residing on each side of 1026 N. Beckley Street were reinterviewed and specifically questioned regarding the presence of a 1961 white Oldsmobile having been parked in their respective driveways at anytime immediately preceding November 22, 1963. It should be noted that previous investigation has developed that JACK L. RUBY owned a 1961 white Oldsmobile. All of the below-named individuals denied recalling a 1961 Oldsmobile having been parked in their driveways at any time and specifically denied having any knowledge of visits by anyone resembling JACK L. RUBY to the rooming house at 1026 N. Beckley Street:
WILLIAM AND LAVANDA WILSON, 1022 N. Beckley Street;
Mr. and Mrs. G.W. MILLER, 1028 N. Beckley Street;
ELLA McNABB, 1030 N. Beckley Street;
LEONARD GRISWOLD, 1014 N. Beckley Street. (Ibid., pp. 106-107)
www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=58974#relPageId=107
Quote off
Did we really expect anything different from the FBI? Notice the sleight of hand that they used too. They were pros with this kind of wording in reports. The original statement used the phrasing of "just prior" to the assassination in terms of when this Oldsmobile parked in their driveway, but the FBI changed it to "anytime IMMEDIATELY preceding November 22, 1963." It isn't huge, but it is different. Just prior could means days ahead of time whereas immediately would suggest the day or evening before the day in question.
The FBI also assumed that Ruby would use his own car (the 1961 white Oldsmobile) and inquired about that particular automobile, but why couldn't he have used another car? Furthermore, why couldn't someone have driven him there? Why was the FBI assuming all the time when it involved things they didn't want to really find out about? Keep in mind, the original report made NO mention of what type of car was parking in the woman's driveway. This may seem small to you, but the FBI did this kind of thing continuously and it adds up to a lot at some point. Investigations should be run with a blank slate and based on initial statements only.
Needless to say, we would progress to the next step of it all being a "mistake." We also see this continually in FBI reports when someone said something they didn't want to hear. On March 20, 1964, T-3 told the FBI that it was probably all gossip and that the FBI should "under no circumstances" interview Mrs. Nance as it could "cost him his job." How could interviewing Mrs. Nance cost T-3 his job? Did he work for her or her family? Moreover, imagine most of us TELLING the FBI what to do and having them listen to us. Not going to happen very much if at all. Why wasn't T-3 admonished for passing on "gossip" and wasting the FBI's time? They did this to other witnesses that reported things that they did NOT want to deal with.
Another informant (T-4) passed on similar information on March 2, 1964, as she said that she attended a meeting of the Oak Cliff Society of Fine Arts on February 7, 1964, and heard Mrs. Dick Loomis state, "I saw Ruby come out of Oswald's apartment." (Ibid., p. 108) Mr. Loomis was the President of the Oak Cliff Society of Fine Arts and T-4 was a member. Of course, the FBI would speak with her, but not give us her first name as they kept referring to her as Mrs. William Loomis.
Quote on
...She attended a meeting of that group on February 7, 1964, at which time she made a remark that she saw a man she believed to be JACK L. RUBY, the convicted murderer or LEE HARVEY OSWALD, get out of a car with another man in the vicinity of her home in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas. She stated they apparently went away to some nearby apartment which she presumed must have been the apartment of LEE HARVEY OSWALD.
...Mrs. LOOMIS advised she has never known either LEE HARVEY OSWALD or JACK L. RUBY and was not positive of any connection between them. However, she stated one of the persons she saw getting out of a car in front of her home seemed to bear a marked resemblance to JACK L. RUBY. She stated she learned from the press, television, radio, and news media that both RUBY and OSWALD had resided in Oak Cliff at one time and she had just drawn her own conclusions about the alleged association.
Mrs. LOOMIS denied making the statement at the February 7, 1964, club meeting that "I saw Ruby come out of Oswald's apartment." (Ibid., p. 109)
www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=58974#relPageId=109
Quote off
Notice that Mrs. Loomis said what I just posited above -- that the man who resembled Jack Ruby got out of a car that had another person in it. Why did the FBI assume Ruby would drive himself in his own car when the original report never mentioned that possibility? Because it allowed them to "investigate" a possibility that they could control and get the right result from -- a negative one. It is easy to reach your conclusion when you put in faulty information.
Keep in mind too that by February 1964 images of Jack Ruby would have been on television and in newspapers a bunch so she would certainly know what he looked like to compare to the man that she observed. There was no motivation to lie about this stuff either as it would bring the wrath of the FBI down upon you.
Again, notice that they had her saying she wasn't aware of "any connection between them'' when this is NOT the relevant portion of her sighting. IF she saw Ruby near LHO's rooming house that is RELEVANT in showing that perhaps they were working on something together. It is how you define the words "connection" and "relationship" as we do NOT need to show this. The burden was on the WC to prove their claims. All we need to do is show that Ruby and LHO had contact prior to the assassination. This sighting and the one mentioned above are good evidence for showing that this was possible. That is all you need as the defense team as you just want to expand the reasonable doubt of your client's guilt. IF this was presented in court it would do that as there is NO other reason for Jack Ruby to be near LHO's rooming house. NONE.
When we add this with all the other information/evidence presented already in other posts showing some kind of connection between the two men it becomes very strong in creating a ton of reasonable doubt.